EP233: Integrative Oncology Is a Clinically Proven Approach—Here’s to Hoping That News Gets Out to Payers and Patients, With Glenn Sabin of FON Consulting
Relentless Health ValueJune 27, 201925:1934.77 MB

EP233: Integrative Oncology Is a Clinically Proven Approach—Here’s to Hoping That News Gets Out to Payers and Patients, With Glenn Sabin of FON Consulting

The Society for Integrative Oncology recently completed a systematic evaluation of peer-reviewed randomized clinical trials for patients with breast cancer. The researchers assigned letter grades to therapies based on the strength of the evidence.

Meditation got an A; it had the strongest evidence supporting its use. Music therapy, yoga, and massage received a B grade. Hypnosis got a C. By the way, the letter grade varied depending on the symptoms that were involved. You can go on the website of the Society for Integrative Oncology if you want to look up the trial itself.

So, here’s my question: Are insurance carriers paying for music therapy, meditation, and yoga? How about cooking classes? Some are, generally if it’s part of the services provided by the cancer center. It’s striking, though, that every single insurance carrier will pay for the downstream costs of unfettered anxiety, stress, poor nutrition … you get the idea—things that an integrative oncology focus would aim to attenuate.

Do employers know about integrative oncology? I think I’d rather have an employee on a cocktail of music therapy and yoga than a cocktail of pretty much anything else.

I’m thinking about this because if these therapies are not covered benefits, then I’m going to doubt that the middle-of-the-bell-curve employees or patients can afford them. Who’s going to “splurge” on meditation classes when GoFundMe has a whole section to help people pay for their traditional cancer care?

Today I speak with Glenn Sabin, an integrative oncology consultant at FON Consulting. Glenn is a nationally recognized thought leader with a reputation for successfully positioning integrative health organizations for sustainable growth.

You can learn more at fonconsulting.com and glennsabin.com.

Glenn Sabin is director of FON Consulting, a leading strategy and business development consultancy specializing in the integrative health and medicine sector. FON’s clients span from medical practices, hospitals, and health systems to nutraceutical, pharmaceutical, and media companies. Glenn brings economic and moral clarity to the misnomer that health creation and promotion cannot align with profitability. 

Glenn is participating in and advising Harvard’s Department of Biomedical Informatics on its People-Powered Medicine NEER Study, an initiative investigating exceptional responders. He was the recipient of American College of Nutrition’s 2017 Communications and Media Award. In 2016 Glenn published his popular memoir, n of 1. Through FON, Glenn also released the freely available 92-page publication The Rise of Integrative Health and Medicine. 


02:36 What is integrative oncology?
04:43 “What’s the quality of life that’s being led here?”—Stacey
05:13 Patient vs host.
06:41 Evidence around the core tenets of lifestyle medicine.
07:19 What the American Society of Clinical Oncology (ASCO) pathways look like.
08:30 The Society for Integrative Oncology.
11:41 Integrative medicine programs and centers within health systems.
13:24 “It happens at the point of diagnosis.”
15:11 The referral process for integrative medicine.
16:10 Integrative medicine and value-based care.
19:04 “Prevention largely via lifestyle choices.”
19:20 Pivoting to engaging around information that’s attractive to millennials.
22:19 “The evidence is there to support these sensible recommendations.”
24:07 Glenn’s advice to administrators: really take a look at integrative health and integrative medicine. 

clinical,healthcare,medicine,oncology,tech,the society for integrative oncology,integrative medicine,lifestyle medicine,integrative health,

Recent Episodes

EP468: Very Common Assumptions That Aren’t Actually True About Member Engagement and the Healthcare Industry, With Matt McQuide
March 20, 2025
468
34:3931.72 MB

EP468: Very Common Assumptions That Aren’t Actually True About Member Engagement and the Healthcare Industry, With Matt McQuide

This conversation today with Matt McQuide is such a follow-on to the episode from last week where I encapsulated a major theme from the past five or six episodes. I know I’m on a roll. The thing is, if an employer doesn’t take the initiative and steer members or help them navigate through our curre...

EP467: Connecting Sky-High ER Spend to Primary Care Access—Following the Dollar Through Carriers and Hospitals, With Stacey Richter
March 13, 2025
467
23:0921.19 MB

EP467: Connecting Sky-High ER Spend to Primary Care Access—Following the Dollar Through Carriers and Hospitals, With Stacey Richter

Here’s my new idea for an episode. Welcome to it. I want to talk about a major theme running through the last few episodes of Relentless Health Value. And this theme is, heads up, going to continue through a few upcoming shows as well. For a full transcript of this episode, click here . If you enjo...

EP466: What Is Rising Faster, Insurance Premiums or Hospital Prices? With Vivian Ho, PhD
March 06, 2025
466
36:1233.13 MB

EP466: What Is Rising Faster, Insurance Premiums or Hospital Prices? With Vivian Ho, PhD

This episode has three chapters. Each one answers a key question, and, bottom line, it all adds up to action steps directly and indirectly for many, including plan sponsors probably, community leaders, and also hospital boards of directors. Here’s the three chapters in sum. For a full transcript of...

EP465: The Not Super Effective Contracting Industry Norm, Where Jumbo Plans and Others Wind Up Paying $10,000 for $50 Drugs, With Chris Crawford
February 27, 2025
465
34:1531.34 MB

EP465: The Not Super Effective Contracting Industry Norm, Where Jumbo Plans and Others Wind Up Paying $10,000 for $50 Drugs, With Chris Crawford

First of all, everybody listening here has probably heard of the lawsuit in which J&J—and talking about J&J as a large employer here now, not as a drug company—but J&J is (or maybe was, there’s action afoot) being sued by a plan member because, here’s the short version, allegedly, the J...

EP464: ER Visits Now 6% of Total Plan Spend. Is It Upcoding or What? With Al Lewis
February 20, 2025
494
31:4028.99 MB

EP464: ER Visits Now 6% of Total Plan Spend. Is It Upcoding or What? With Al Lewis

Today, I am speaking with the one, the only Al Lewis, and we’re gonna talk about how 6% of a lot of plan sponsors’ total spend is now going to ER/ED (emergency room/emergency department) visits. That’s a lot of spend. For a full transcript of this episode, click here . If you enjoy this podcast, be...

EP463: Medicare Advantage Policies—Which Will Stay and Which Will Go Now? With Betsy Seals
February 13, 2025
463
35:1132.2 MB

EP463: Medicare Advantage Policies—Which Will Stay and Which Will Go Now? With Betsy Seals

Every Gen X’er listening to this is gonna be singing that Clash  song in your head for the rest of the day. So, let’s turn our attention to Medicare Advantage policy. And on the show today, I grill the one and only Betsy Seals to find out which policies she thinks are going to stay and which a...

Encore! EP384: How Shareholders Impact Carrier Behavior, Exactly and Specifically, With Wendell Potter
February 06, 202535:0132.05 MB

Encore! EP384: How Shareholders Impact Carrier Behavior, Exactly and Specifically, With Wendell Potter

I am drowning in all things Q1 right now. So, this week we’re going with an encore. But this is a great show to go back and reflect upon, as it’s about carriers and how shareholders impact the actions of said carriers. For a full transcript of this episode, click here . If you enjoy this podcast, b...

Listen and Follow

Sponsored by Aventria Health Group
©2025 BD Bridges LLC. All Rights Reserved.